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Post turtle - that is hilarious, and a great analogy.
As far as the election goes, I don't think it is over yet. We've got to put the word out to get out there and vote no matter what the media is trying to tell us. I believe it is going to be a lot closer than they are reporting.

Humbled Infidel

[this is good] Great article. 


I really enjoyed that story when I first heard it.  Your commentary brings the wisdom in it to full light.


Fox News are the mastors of spin.


Please SPECIFY how.  On Fox news, they put people on from both sides of whatever issue it presented.  They give equal time to both, ask them both questions, and then let YOU decide.  Hence the "We report, you decide" phrase in their advertising.There's not just a Sean Hannity.  There's a Sean Hannity and an Alan Colmes.  Every time they talk about any issue relating to politics, they have actual representatives (not so-called "experts") to give their views.With NBC, CBS, ABC, and CNN (though mostly obvious with NBC), you get one side of an issue and a so-called "expert's" view of the opposition.  I can guarantee that the liberal view is promoted, and the conservative one is challenged.Case in point, Barack Hussein Obama himself:The "Drive-by" media (those not Fox), protects, and refuses to investigate wide-open screaming out for investigation aspects of this presidential candidate, not for for honesty and real journalism.  They actually want one specific guy elected and have signed on via obvious actions and inactions to the bandwagon to help in any way possible.How many conservative candidates would get away with anti-American (some even unrepentant TERRORISTS) close and personal friends.  Not acquaintances, but those he's know for many many years and even attends parties and campaign strategy meetings with.  What about those (more than one) under investigation for felony crimes, that are Obama's buddies and even financer's?The Drive-by media ignores these things and gives a man, who is running for the most powerful and influential office in the world, a free pass.The man has NO EXPERIENCE!  The man has questionable associations,.  No, not one "ooops I had no idea he was like that" person, but a boat load of them!  In fact, those he calls friends.Then there's Barack Obama's own personal writings, his books with blatant anti-white racism, anti-american socialism, and many many more.On the other side of the coin.  Nothing stops the drive-by media to attempt to slander and destroy a PRIVATE CITIZEN merely asking a question of Obama!  Is this what we can expect if Obama were President?  The thought police?!  Anyone with an opposing view is treated as criminal.  What about going after the family members of John  McCain and Sarah Palin?  Sending hundreds of people to Alaska and Arizona to dig up dirt, yet I don't know of any in Illinois digging up the vast amounts of filth Obama has to show.  Ask those in his own constituency about their "confidence" in him.  They hate him, he collected money from slum lords and ignored them.Fox News, bless them are the only agency I have seen that has investigated BOTH candidates and presented the facts and told you to decide what they mean.  How is that spin?  Is it spin because they don't tell you how to think?You know, you might want to actually WATCH Fox News before making such a blanket comment.  It just shows you have never actually watched Fox News.Frankly, I think it's disgusting to see someone like Katie Couric swoon over Obama and never ask him important questions.  No, she and the rest of her indoctrinated drones (oh there you are) just see their next messiah.  Get ready blondie, the spaceship is almost here!!Thank God for Fox News.  It's the only place on the planet these days you can get the news without someone telling you what it means and how you whould feel according to their own liberal bias.So if you want to make such a bletantly ininformed statement here, you'd better back it up with facts, and not what you saw on Oprah.


Sparky you ARE Super!  You're my hero!


Blushing profusely.Now if only women I meet personally would say that...Thank you, thank you so much!  You really made my day!


You want to know how Fox News are masters of spin? Watch this. Go on, I dare you. 


Oh please don't tell me you tried to refer me to the "Out-Foxed" web site.  A little education is in order if you believe that drivel:There's a difference between programs on the Fox News channel and the Fox News Bureau which reports the news on that same channel.Bill O'Reilly is NOT conservative.  Take it from me, a conservative, he's not.  Nevertheless, he has a program on the Fox News channel.  What Bill says is Bill's opinion, not Fox News.Sean Hannity is a conservative, Alan Colmes is a liberal.  Both work for Fox News channel and happen to have a program on it.  Both have their own views and opinions, yet both are on the Fox News Channel, but not the News Bureau.Gretta Van Sustern has her own show, and I could go on, but that does not have anything to do with the Fox News Bureau and the NEWS and people with separate programs on the channel.Many in the Fox News Bureau are former CBS, NBC and ABC reporters and anchor-persons.  Highly respected people like Brit Hume, Chris Wallace, Megyn Kelly, Bill Hemmer (who is by no means a conservative), Martha MacCallum, and Trace Gallagher.  All highly respected in their field.  They report the news fairly and from both sides.  How?  It's simple, they bring on representatives from both sides to tell their story.  I don't know how that is spin, but to each their own.In fact, Fox News makes an extra effort to show and tell both sides of a story when there is one (this includes politics).  By the way, a thing isn't "spin" if it's the truth, no matter how much someone hates or denies it.  When something is said that is absolute and 100% provable and one side doesn't like it, then that's too bad.  The side that doesn't like it is spinning.I like the parts where it compares Kerry's campaign to Obama's and Fox's reporting of it.  The problem here is the stuff pointed out is all documented and true about each candidate.  Those trying to say Fox is "spinning" only say it because both these men had something to hide or deny in this case, yet the proof was in the history.Good journalism isn't about kissing a candidates ass or doing what the candidate says to not do.  It's about finding and telling the facts.  This is something CBS, and especially NBC have been greatly lacking in.  I don't see the hard reporting on OBama's personal associations, many sleazy criminals or ex-criminals, and one a proud terrorist.  No, what's reported on by those spinning jackasses is what Sarah Palin is or isn't wearing today.  Even so-called media watchdog organizations claim there is an obvious bias of the media to positive Obama reporting and strictly negative McCain reporting.  Anything negative about Obama is ignored and anything positive about McCain is likewise ignored.  That's called "SPIN".As to Fox News, I have heard them give McCain or a representative thereof, just as hard hitting questions as they have given Obama.  Obama is the one that always seems to do the spinning.CBS, NBC, CNN, don't ever seem to have a representative from both sides of a story to comment on it.  No, they just usually had hired hacks that are so-called "experts" give there usually lopsided view.  Who the heck named them an expert?Snowy, if every news channel was judged on their top rated shows, then perhaps CNN is not as liberal as they seem to be.  Why?  Glenn Beck is their highest rated program that is not the news.  He's a conservative.  Does that make CNN conservative biased?  Oh my word no.OutFoxed tries to also make the case that FoxNews is some sort of corporate (or Rupert Murdoch's) conspiracy to subvert the news.  No, Fox News shows what is a successful business model that people will actually want to watch.  Not some self-righteous pontificating puffer-fish like Dan Rather was, telling people to trust him because he's Dan Rather, or Katie Couric, because she's perky.  No, Fox News is made of happy and attractive news people that have the talent and freedom to report the news as it is, without being told to spin it as they want them to hear.George Soros, on the other hand, pretty much owns the other people in the "news media" and Democrat party, and coincidentally, left-wing web sites like "", "", "mediamatters" ,etc.  They do what George says.  Agencies like NBC or the New York Times fail because are they have become is the Democrat talking points broadcast bureau and it's quite obvious.When I see things like OutFoxed, or Farenheit 911, or Inconvenient Truth, I see desperation, not truth.To see how liberal biased and spun NBC or CBS is, all you have to do is watch one broadcast.  I have never heard more news stories with opinionated conclusions than on CBS and NBC.  It's so blatant it's pathetic.  This is documented.Remember those media watch-dog groups (the legitimate ones) I mentioned earlier?  Well, it seems Fox News shows the least amount of bias and virtually no anchor based conclusions, compared to the others.  In other words, Fox News is fair and balanced.So, to summarize:The O'Reilly Factor is not the newsHannity and Colmes is not the newsHannity's America is not the newsOn the Record, With Gretta Van Sustern is not the newsEtc.However, when the news on Fox News is being reported as THE NEWS, then you have a fair and balanced approach to reporting the news.  The other shows are ENTERTAINMENT.  CNN and MSNBC has these too.  Learn the difference.Just because Bill O'Reily or Sean Hannity says something, doesn't mean it's Fox News.  The one doing the spinning is "OutFoxed".


Odd, replying to myself, but...Seriously, Fox News is far from conservative.  They are neither.  Frankly, I'd rather watch a conservative news agency for once, but none exist.LEFT=========================================RIGHT=======================FOX========================NBC=====================================================CBS======================================================CNN==============================MSNBC============================================Notice how Fox is in the center.  However, dealing with relative positions, yes, Fox News is furthest right than the rest.  This is how most liberals judge Fox News, and it's simply because they refuse to step left.


I got as far as " Bill O'Reilly is NOT conservative". I couldn't continue after that as I dissolved into uncontrollable fits of laughter. Your reason? Because you say so. Hardly a convincing reason. The fact that he parrots the Murdoch conservative line faithfully does nothing for your credibility. That you dismiss "Outfoxed" as drivel shows that you are incapable of looking at anything through unbiased eyes. I won't be bothering to comment any further.


You mean I dismissed "OutFoxed" like you dismissed my claims about Bill O'Reilly?  Hmm... oddly ironic isn't it?  Snowy, I've alreay seen the claims of OutFoxed.  Nothing was added by me seeing the web site, although I did, and read through most of the headlines and so-called "proof".All you and your reply has done is just prove you can't read or listen to anything contrary to what you have already convinced yourself.  Listen, did I say Bill O'Reilly was liberal?  No, he's not.  In fact, I'd say he's definitely further right than you or any other liberal.  So in terms of relativity, he's "conservative" compared to you.  However, Bill O'Reilly is not a conservative by any means, compared to a conservative.I can "say so", because I happen to be a conservative.  I also happen to know other conservatives.  I also happen to know what being a conservative really means, and Snowy, Bill O'Reilly is no conservative.  He's an independent, neither left nor right.  Nevertheless, he has some beliefs and prinicples that ground him where he is.  Sometimes a little to the right, sometimes a little to the left.  What makes him different from a liberal is that he can articulate what and why he believes that way.Here are some examples as to WHY he's not a conservative:Homosexuality:  He says he's not against it.  He's "whatever floats your boat".Marriage:  He says anyone should be able to marry anyone they want to.  Oddly enough, he does warn of this openning up a can of worms when it comes to polygomy, but only in a legal, not moral sense.Economics:  He says government needs to put even more restrictions on everything.  Definitely not a conservative here.Abortion:  He's mixed on this one.  He says a woman always has a right to choose at any early stage of prenancy, but also states he doesn't like abortion.  Pretty schizophrenic here on this topic.  Definitelty not a conservative view.Those are the big issues with O'Reilly.  I am sure there are liberal aspects he doesn't match either, but nevertheless, I'd say over all he's an independant with a bad attitude.  Yes, I don't like the guy either.


One more thing, about Murdoch.Contrary to George Soros, a billionaire who just tosses his money around, usually through shell corporations and Swiss bank accounts to avoid taxation, and does it to push a highly liberal and socialist agenda, like "OutFoxed" etc.Rupert Murdoch is a conservative businessman.  He knows what works and doesn't.  He's far more concerned with the bottom line that with pushing some right-wing agenda.  He knows what business model works, and has proved it year after year with Fox News.  He did notice the main stream media was always liberally biased, and yes, he did not like the idea of having to watch that drivel.  Like any conservative, he wanted to hear the situation and make his own decisions on what it meant.So, he started Fox News with a simple policy, "We report, you decide".  This very simple idea, something journalism should have been teaching journalists, has shown it brings the most ratings, and hence the most revenue from advertisers.  I can guarantee you that had this model been a failure, Murdoch would have tossed it and moved on to something else.  Why?  He's a conservative.  Conservatives don't waste money on pointless endeavors.What's even more amazing to me is that with all of the George Soros money being pumped into various liberal media, they all still are failures or nearly ready to fail.  Fox News makes its own money on its own merits.  It's not a bottomless pit like liberal radio or PBS or CBS or NBC who keep losing viewers by doing the same thing, except even more obviously.It's really funny to see news agencies like CNN, run by a liberal, start using some of Murdoch's ideas.  Heck, they even brought on a conservative and restored revenue.  Glenn Beck was their ace in the hole.  He brought back viewers like crazy.  I wonder what they are going to do when Glenn moves to Fox News next year...Fox News is a business and run as such.  It's not an agenda clearing house as most Soros funding things are.  That's something a liberal will never understand.  Liberals think conservatives link like they do and that's their downfall.

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